osprey_archer: (books)
[personal profile] osprey_archer
After Kazuo Ishiguro’s Klara and the Sun absolutely blew me away, I decided that I had to read more of his books… after a suitable waiting period, because it seemed unfair to subject any book to close comparison with Klara and the Sun.

The waiting period has passed, and I dived back into Ishiguro’s The Remains of the Day, which also blew me away. I love books that immerse the reader in a point of view that they may find alien, and Ishiguro simply knocks it out of the park. In Klara and the Sun, that POV character is a Klara, a robot programmed to be the perfect friend; in The Remains of the Day, the mid-twentieth century butler Stevens strives to completely inhabit his role as butler.

There is of course a certain commonality between these two viewpoints: both characters define themselves as conduits of service toward their principals. But they approach the topic from completely different angles. Klara and the Sun shows a state of acceptance so complete that it can imagine no alternate state of non-acceptance, whereas in The Remains of the Day Stevens is looking back on his long years of service to a man who perhaps was not morally worthy of this total sacrifice.

But Stevens can’t allow himself to look at this directly, because “butler” is his whole identity. He comments repeatedly that a great butler sets aside his dignity only when he is absolutely alone, and he is so completely encased by that dignity that he’s basically unable to respond when, for instance, his housekeeper Miss Kenton loses her only living relative, or indeed even to acknowledge that he’s in love with Miss Kenton.

(One feels that Miss Kenton may have dodged a bullet there, but then a Stevens capable of admitting that he loved Miss Kenton might have been a Stevens capable of being a good husband.)

It’s just fascinating to be immersed in this viewpoint where the job completely subsumes the personal identity - or ought to completely subsume it; Stevens occasionally slips in times of great emotion. And Ishiguro just nails that point of view. No matter how uncomfortable the character’s actions may be for the reader, you never feel that Ishiguro is winking at you to let you know that he knows this is messed up. The author is totally effaced at the service of his characters - which is, in its own way, a bravura display of authorial skill.

***

Which other Ishiguro books should I read? I know that Never Let Me Go is the other famous one. (I put off reading Ishiguro for years because I found the premise of Never Let Me Go so off putting, but at this point I might read it…)

Date: 2023-04-16 01:30 pm (UTC)
troisoiseaux: (Default)
From: [personal profile] troisoiseaux
Which other Ishiguro books should I read?

I haven't read it, but The Buried Giant is about "elderly Briton couple ... living in a fictional post-Arthurian England in which no-one is able to retain long-term memories," which may or may not be up your alley.

(I have also been put off of reading any of Ishiguro's books by the existence of Never Let Me Go, but it sounds like he's worth a shot?)

Date: 2023-04-16 01:59 pm (UTC)
asakiyume: (more than two)
From: [personal profile] asakiyume
Sounds like all three of these deal with people subsuming themselves entirely for other people's benefit, even unto death. That's a rich theme but wow, a tricky one.

Date: 2023-04-16 07:00 pm (UTC)
sovay: (I Claudius)
From: [personal profile] sovay
people subsuming themselves entirely for other people's benefit, even unto death. That's a rich theme but wow, a tricky one.

It's one of the reasons I'm interested in Living (2022), beyond Bill Nighy and the usual compare-and-contrast instinct; if it follows its original, it'll be Ishiguro writing about someone who figures out how to stop doing that.

Date: 2023-04-16 08:19 pm (UTC)
asakiyume: (miroku)
From: [personal profile] asakiyume
Interesting! I had (a) forgotten/not known that Ishiguro did the screenplay for that and (b)hadn't thought of the original Kurosawa movie in those terms--so now I'm wondering if that's because this re-visioning has a different focus or whether I just missed that in the original.

Date: 2023-04-16 08:29 pm (UTC)
sovay: (I Claudius)
From: [personal profile] sovay
forgotten/not known that Ishiguro did the screenplay for that

I first heard it was happening because I ran across an article in which Ishiguro talked about how it had occurred to him to re-set the story in England of the same period, which it would be useful if I remembered the details of.

so now I'm wondering if that's because this re-visioning has a different focus or whether I just missed that in the original.

From what I have read, I don't know that the new film has a different focus so much as the idea of stepping outside of the cogs of bureaucracy has a different resonance in context of Ishiguro's work, where his characters are more likely to stay on the rails of their assigned roles, than it does in Kurosawa's.

Date: 2023-04-16 08:36 pm (UTC)
asakiyume: (miroku)
From: [personal profile] asakiyume
*nodding*

I'm happy to think of Ishiguro thinking in these terms. And yeah, in the Kurusawa, my sense was that the guy had subsumed his life to societal expectations and was reclaiming a small measure of freedom--which is related, but not quite the same thing as giving your life over to another individual person.

Date: 2023-04-16 04:34 pm (UTC)
edwardianspinsteraunt: "Edwardian Interior" by Howard Gilman (Default)
From: [personal profile] edwardianspinsteraunt
The Remains of the Day is quite possibly my favourite book of all time, so it was a delight to read your review! I actually haven't read any of Ishiguro's other books yet, because I'm afraid they won't be as good, but one day I'll have to summon up the courage to do so!

I can, however, wholeheartedly recommend the Merchant Ivory film adaptation, which complements the book in a really lovely way and contains some absolutely stellar acting. For me, it made the Stevens/Kenton romance a lot more believable, because it has the advantage of not spending so much time in Stevens' head and therefore making it more obvious when he's being unreliable and/or not living up to his ideals of dignity. (It also pulls this off quite subtly without doing too much of the wink wink authorial stuff that you rightly criticise, which is an impressive feat!)

Date: 2023-04-17 10:54 am (UTC)
edwardianspinsteraunt: "Edwardian Interior" by Howard Gilman (Default)
From: [personal profile] edwardianspinsteraunt
Yes, that feeling exactly! Several of my friends have recommended An Artist of the Floating World to me, which is set in post-WWII Japan and likewise features an ageing protagonist trying to pretend that he has no regrets whatsoever about his past complicity in morally questionable causes (I sense this is a bit of a theme in Ishiguro), so I may try that one next...

That's a good point. I'll confess I do ship Stevens and Miss Kenton myself, but I also freely acknowledge that Stevens is a bit of an asshole and, like you say, not great husband material. I think what makes it believable for me is that it would take such a massive amount of character development for Stevens to let himself have any personal life at all, that in the (admittedly unlikely) event that he was able to take that step, I think it could just about work. I mean, he's clearly capable of great devotion, it's just all given to the wrong cause and person!

Date: 2023-04-16 06:53 pm (UTC)
sovay: (Rotwang)
From: [personal profile] sovay
Which other Ishiguro books should I read? I know that Never Let Me Go is the other famous one.

It's the other Ishiguro I have read besides The Remains of the Day and it shares the quality of protagonists who are so deeply damaged that the novel never calls attention to it, because under the circumstances what else could they possibly be? I read it after seeing the film, which is a surprisingly faithful transfer of the emotional tone, including the refusal to give the audience any reassuring reality checks. Neither version is the kind of science fiction that cares especially about how its world got here as opposed to what it can do with the metaphors, but it didn't wreck the effect for me.

Date: 2023-04-17 01:57 pm (UTC)
kateoftheangels: Credit thisbluespirit [dw] (Default)
From: [personal profile] kateoftheangels
I adored Remains, and admired Floating World, but couldn't get through Never Let Me Go (my sister hated it so much she literally threw it at a wall). The things you liked - - Ishiguro's stunning writing and deeply immersive POV work - - are all there, and masterfully so, but I found it hard to get past the horrific premise and [hopefully not a spoiler] its ending. Read with full warnings, essentially! That said, Klara sounds like it would be more my speed, and Sister's, too.

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