osprey_archer: (books)
[personal profile] osprey_archer
[personal profile] littlerhymes and I have finished Mary Stewart's The Wicked Day! To my surprise, this was my favorite book of the quartet, because I got deeply invested in Mordred the lonely watchful child who would rather die than hurt Arthur, and also has to ride herd on all his horrible Orkney half-brothers.

(Side note about the Orkney boys: Gareth is, as usual, the sweetheart of the gang. Indeed, Stewart notes that as long as he stayed on Orkney, where he was his mother's pet, he was "in danger of effeminacy" - which is perhaps why he escapes the toxic masculinity that destroys the rest of them. Usually Gawain is the second-best Orkney boy, but here he's just as vengeful and hotheaded as Gaheris and Agrivaine. Sometimes you see a decent Gaheris, but no one in the entire world of Arthurian adaptations seems to like Agrivaine.)

Unfortunately, the book falls apart in the third section, I think because Stewart also got invested in Mordred, Basically a Good Kid Which Is Impressive Considering His Life. Her heart is not in Mordred's destruction of Camelot, but unfortunately she's written herself in a corner where she has to write it, as in the Merlin trilogy she firmly established a) Merlin's prophecy that Mordred would destroy Arthur, and b) Merlin's infallibility as a prophet.

She tries to soften the blow: Mordred's final confrontation with Arthur takes place as a result of a series of misunderstandings. Mordred is Arthur's heir, so when he hears that Arthur is dead he naturally takes over the kingdom, but Arthur is not dead, and when he comes back to England a storm forces him to land on Saxon ground... which leads to a battle with the Saxons, with whom Mordred unfortunately just made an alliance... which ends with Mordred and Arthur facing off in battle.

And then they have a final parlay, which Stewart doesn't show us (they died right after! no one knows what they said! YOU COULD TELL US ANYWAY), and reach an agreement... and then an adder bites a knight and the knight draws his sword to kill it and the soldiers take that as a sign for battle to begin and THAT IS THAT.

In the afterword she notes that the only historical information we have about Mordred is that he died at Camlann with Arthur, in a context where he might just as easily have been fighting on Arthur's side as against him, and she might have followed that route if she hadn't locked herself with all those prophecies. I think the book would have been stronger for it if she had - or else if she had Mordred betray Arthur at least a little. It feels too easy, too much letting the characters off the hook, for it to all be just a misunderstanding.

***

Also I am 99% convinced that Elizabeth Wein read this book to absolute shreds when she was young, because her Medraut so feels like a darkfic version of Stewart's (in particular, an expansion of the scene where Morgause kisses Mordred, when he is not yet aware that he's her son but she definitely knows. How did you expect that to pan out, Morgause! Did you assume he would never know!), and also a fix-it where Medraut doesn't cause the fall of Camelot after all - although Camelot still falls.

Date: 2022-11-27 05:44 pm (UTC)
troisoiseaux: (Default)
From: [personal profile] troisoiseaux
Her heart is not in Mordred's destruction of Camelot, but unfortunately she's written herself in a corner where she has to write it, as in the Merlin trilogy she firmly established a) Merlin's prophecy that Mordred would destroy Arthur, and b) Merlin's infallibility as a prophet.

I mean, that just makes it all the more tragic— like, something something prophesy that is technically true, but blames the butterfly who flaps its wing for the hurricane's destruction, and a Fate that's so grimly inevitable that neither Arthur's most desperate attempts (I assume this series covers the May Babies episode?) nor Mordred's best intentions can prevent it from happening...?

Date: 2022-11-27 10:18 pm (UTC)
troisoiseaux: (Default)
From: [personal profile] troisoiseaux
the high drama of Mordred's visit to Nimue when he says he'll kill himself rather than hurt Arthur! And Nimue tells him that would only bring about Arthur's downfall in some different and perhaps swifter fashion!

Now I want a time loop novel where Mordred keeps trying again and again to avoid causing the fall of Camelot until he finally snaps and throws himself into bringing it about because he gives up!! Clearly its fate!! He can't reject fate!!!

Yes, the series covers the May Babies, although in this case Morgause goads Lot into it and then pins the blame of Arthur by claiming Arthur ordered it done.

Hmm. So, the vibe I'm getting here is that she doesn't like making her Favorites make Bad Decisions?

Date: 2022-11-28 03:19 pm (UTC)
skygiants: Hohenheim from Fullmetal Alchemist with tears streaming down his cheeks; text 'I'm a monsteeeer' (man of constant sorrow)
From: [personal profile] skygiants
I ALSO DESPERATELY WANT TIME LOOP MORDRED. I made a joke about "everything everywhere all at once and future king" on Twitter a while ago but I do actually think that is the natural endpoint of the cyclical Arthurian tragedy and I'm shocked nobody yet has done it (that I'm aware of)!

Date: 2022-11-27 07:58 pm (UTC)
sovay: (I Claudius)
From: [personal profile] sovay
To my surprise, this was my favorite book of the quartet, because I got deeply invested in Mordred the lonely watchful child who would rather die than hurt Arthur, and also has to ride herd on all his horrible Orkney half-brothers.

I think you have mistyped The Last Enchantment for The Wicked Day, which is fine because The Wicked Day is a more interesting novel. It's one of Renault's very few third-person narratives, too.

In the afterword she notes that the only historical information we have about Mordred is that he died at Camlann with Arthur, in a context where he might just as easily have been fighting on Arthur's side as against him, and she might have followed that route if she hadn't locked herself with all those prophecies.

This is the thing I really wish she had done with the novel, even if she had to retcon herself. Prophecies always come true on the slant, anyway.

(I am structurally fine with her choice to make the tragedy of Camelot a devastating misunderstanding, I just don't find this novel's particular take to carry the necessary inevitable horror: it doesn't convince me there was never any other way out.)

Date: 2022-11-27 09:11 pm (UTC)
sovay: (Rotwang)
From: [personal profile] sovay
Or if she hadn't tried to cram so much material into the last section?

That couldn't have hurt. Especially considering the leisurely childhood opening, the breakneck of the tragedy is pretty zero-to-KABOOM. The stuff with Guenivere is also really interesting, but just barely sketched.

the quartet goes out with a whimper instead of a bang.

I'll try to find the interview with her where she explained that she didn't mean to write an Arthurian quartet, The Crystal Cave was supposed to be a standalone, but then she just kept thinking about the stories.
Edited Date: 2022-11-27 09:12 pm (UTC)

Date: 2022-11-27 11:22 pm (UTC)
brigid: drawing of two women, one whispering to the other (Default)
From: [personal profile] brigid
I mean, I would have been very fine with a Mordred trilogy. Me, right here. I would have loved that. Where is my alternate universe where that exists?

I imprinted HARD on these books as a kid, I read the first one about a million times.

Date: 2022-11-28 11:07 am (UTC)
littlerhymes: (Default)
From: [personal profile] littlerhymes
It feels too easy, too much letting the characters off the hook, for it to all be just a misunderstanding.

I had higher expectations for the ending based on how she worked and re-worked the story in the Merlin books, she did such interesting things with working both with and against the legends like the Nimue thing or the May Day babies thing. And it was interesting to compare the ending to her end notes, like ok I see the vision but...

BUT it was overall a good book and you ARE a Mordred stan and this HAS been such a good experience (to be continued).

Date: 2022-11-30 06:54 am (UTC)
littlerhymes: (Default)
From: [personal profile] littlerhymes
Please hold, I am intending to send it to you!

Date: 2022-11-30 01:42 pm (UTC)
littlerhymes: (Default)
From: [personal profile] littlerhymes
I am planning to send a few things but if you want to read it asap library is probably best!

Date: 2022-12-01 01:07 pm (UTC)
littlerhymes: (Default)
From: [personal profile] littlerhymes
Then I will send! Just got to get my stuff together. How did December creep up so fast...

Date: 2022-11-29 05:53 am (UTC)
genarti: Knees-down view of woman on tiptoe next to bookshelves (Default)
From: [personal profile] genarti
Oh dear! Yeah, I think writing yourself into the situation where Mordred definitely has to cause the downfall of Camelot but also you can't bring yourself to write Mordred as actually betraying Arthur (and/or as being anything but morally justified in doing so) inherently weakens the depiction of, well, Mordred causing the downfall of Camelot. Though perhaps it's partly just Stewart rushing through to get to the end she doesn't want to get to, from the sound of it... (I really need to give this trilogy another try one of these days! As I think I've said, in my youth I read The Crystal Cave, read most of the second book, and then went back to reread The Crystal Cave a bunch rather than go on to the tragic bits, lol.)

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